ADI MAHALEL ORAL HISTORY

CHRISTA WHITNEY:So, this is Christa Whitney, and today is December 15th, 2013. I am here at the Association for Jewish Studies conference in Boston with -- and can you pronounce your name so I don't say it wrong?

ADI MAHALEL:It's Adi Mahalel, or even better Adi M'halel, but it doesn't matter. You can say Adi Mahalel.

CW:Mahalel. Mahalel. And we are going to record an interview as part of the Yiddish Book Center's Wexler Oral History Project. Do I have your permission to record?

AM:Yes.

CW:Okay. So, as I said, we can start in English, and anything you want to answer in Yiddish, just go right ahead. So, first of all, can you tell me what you know 1:00about your family background, briefly?

AM:What I know -- well, I have people in my family that did research on the family background -- well, I can do a sketch.

CW:Okay.

AM:It's elaborate. So, I -- basically two -- both my grandfathers were born in Palestine, and one of them was from mixed Jewish Moroccan, Jewish Syrian descent, and the other one from Jewish Lithuanian background. And his side -- actually, he was born in Palestine, but I think he knew more Yiddish than all the other ones. And also, on his side, from research done by a family member, I 2:00later in life discovered some Yiddish yikhes [ancestry]. She found that there's a -- kind of at the time known Yiddish actor, [Pavel Baratov?], [Pavel Brenner?], who was in the Yiddish theater in New York and Philadelphia. And before then, he was a doctor to czar in Russia. It was a whole story. So, they're somewhere far related. And then also, her uncle -- well, I'm talking her, her name is Chana, she was in Haifa. And she's the -- she's basically -- she's very far related. She's married to the -- she was married to the cousin of my grandfather, and her uncle, she collected a -- she created a memoir of -- a 3:00memoir with this -- he was a Hebrew writer in Warsaw.

CW:What was his name?

AM:[Israel Schef?]. I didn't want to get it wrong. Now, it's -- so, she created this book about him from his writing and his memoir. I realized that for him, he was one of the secret translators of I.L. Peretz into Hebrew, 'cause at some point, I.L. Peretz kind of stopped writing his own Hebrew, towards the turn of the twentieth century. And he -- so, he was -- so, he let writers like that (UNCLEAR) of mine to write it. And he's later discovered -- I mean, both of those family members of the Yiddish yikhes found in all kinds of Yiddish books. But he -- I discovered him, he was the Yiddish teacher of Yiddish writers -- a Hebrew teacher of Yiddish writers like Zeitlin. So, in the memoirs of Zeitlin, I 4:00hear -- I see that he was a teacher, used to fall asleep sometimes when he was teaching. It's very funny. And other writers mentioned in -- I think Avrom Reyzen, in his memoir, so -- and I read some of his Hebrew novels, but that's later in life. So, that's one side. And the grandmas were actually born in Europe, and came at an early age to Palestine, in the 1930s, one from Brisk, Brest-Litovsk -- I think 1935. She was a young teenager in Brisk. She was -- she went to Tarbut school, which is the Hebrew Zionist school system, and she became a Hebrew teacher in Israel later. And as you see, nobody -- none of them were Yiddish speakers, and she spoke Polish and Russian, not Yiddish. It was -- they actually had to -- came to Brest-Litovsk, they were part of the few Jews who 5:00were in Moscow before, and then they were driven away. There was the Moscow expulsion. And so, that's her story. And the other grandmother, my maternal grandmother, she was born in Hamburg, in Germany, and she -- 1933. It's a good time to leave. (laughter) They decided to emigrate to Palestine, 'cause -- it's enough that there's one Zionist in the family to collect everybody somehow in a place. And she -- yeah, now, it's funny, I can spin an anecdote about that, because when my mother was, by chance, in an air flight with some head of the Association of German Jews in Israel -- and when he heard that my grandmother 6:00was born in Hamburg -- and then he was extremely interested. But then, when he discovered that she left in 1933, he said -- he -- immediately lost interest at that particular point. Why? For him, it's like Ostjuden, because two generations before, they did come from Galicia, and he knew immediately that the Jews who left -- even though she was born in Germany and her parents -- those who left Germany at that time, the German Jews who left in '33, were only Ostjuden, only Eastern European Jews, 'cause the German Jews were not -- so, they -- was too bonded to the place than to leave. So, they did grow up with German -- but I know they had -- 'cause I later in life studied German with her sister, my great aunt. I discovered that they had an uncle -- not an uncle, a grandfather at home 7:00that stayed at home and spoke only Yiddish, from Galicia. So, they picked all kinds of expressions, so -- I got that, as well. And my parents were both born in Haifa, in Israel, northern part of Israel. So, my grandmother, the yeke, the German Jew, is kind of -- there was kind of a yeke community on the Carmel in Haifa established at the time. So, she was kind of part of it. And she met my grandfather, the Syrian Moroccan -- she was a -- who was a famous Arabic -- teacher of Arabic. And so, he wrote books to teach Arabic to Hebrew speakers. And so it was kind of a mixture. But he learned German, as well, so, the -- kind of -- they connected that way. And yes, so I -- both my parents were born in 8:00Haifa. My father was a -- in his youth -- active in socialist Zionist groups, Hashomer Hatsair. But then, you know, Shomer Hatsair's dwindling. And my -- yeah, they -- and I was born in 1979, in Haifa, to Hebrew-speaking parents and grandparents. (laughs) That's my story. That's my Yiddish tale. (laughs)

CW:Okay, let me stop for one second. [BREAK IN RECORDING] So, yeah, so you grew up in a Hebrew-speaking environment. Can you describe the home that you grew up in? What was the Jewish culture of your home?

AM:Good question. As I said, my father was Hashomer Hatsair. In Israel, the nickname for that is a shmutsnik, of course, those are the Shomer Hatsair. And 9:00they were very anti-religious. So, basically, that's -- I grew up very secular. My only -- my -- somewhere in my twenties, when a friend came with me to my parents' house, I discovered we don't have a mezuzah, 'cause she was looking for the mezuzah and she couldn't find it. 'Cause I didn't think about it before, 'cause I didn't care. So, I just realized, somewhere in my twenties, that there's no mezuzah in the house. So, sorry, but the Jewish culture that I grew up -- so, it's typical -- I guess typical secular Israeli. Secular means that you don't go to a synagogue so much. I mean, I only did bar mitzvah in a Reform temple in Haifa, which is not so common just -- in Israel, only because my grandmother from -- the yeke -- insisted, and she paid for it. (laughter) 'Cause my father didn't really want to do that -- so, yeah, that's how I ended up doing 10:00the bar mitzvah. And I guess the Jewishness -- I guess is the highly regard -- the high regard you relate to Hebrew literature. 'Cause I grew up with some strong Hebraism around me. So, Hebrew, reading Hebrew literature, discussing it -- was very highly regarded. I mean, it was a mark of high culture. So, I guess that was a Jewish -- so, we did seders. Not too rigid. And there's Shabbat dinners, but there's not -- nothing besides eating. It's a typical secular -- so, besides eating, you don't do any -- no ceremony. But you get together, I mean. And yeah, so not much synagogue, yeah. Not much praying, not much God. But 11:00high regard for modern Israeli literature, some modern Hebrew literature. I say -- I differentiate, because if it was high regard to Agnon, for instance -- then you can relate him more to the modern Hebrew literature, the European one, and also the -- it's the whole question of how strongly they relate to them, the modern Israeli writers, the bigger ones like Amos Oz and Grossman. Yeah, those are the big names my parents -- and maybe I rebelled a bit, because I barely read Amos Oz, I must admit, or Meir Shalev, or David Grossman, I barely read them -- I'm honest. And those are the biggest rabonim (laughter) that -- I kind of have, so -- my parents have. So --

CW:Can you describe what the house looked like, what -- the house you grew up in? What does it look like?

AM:Well, we moved --

CW:Yeah.

AM:My father's an aca-- I didn't say what my father's -- actually did -- do. My fathers -- my parents. My father's an academic in an engineering school in Haifa, the Technion, and -- which I started, actually, studying -- and then I left. Maybe that's just another mini-rebellion. And so, he moved, as an academic. So, we now -- being interviewed in Boston. I spent my third grade here in Boston, for instance. And, besides that -- and I've been in London, too. We moved -- different apartments in Haifa. And my parents live now is where I spent lots of my high school and before, which was kind of upper middle class area of 13:00Haifa, which my parents -- just forgive me -- but I don't care for it so much. I mean, they love it. It's a beautiful view over the Carmel and the ocean, and it's very peaceful. You can see all kind of wild animals when you -- just from the porch, you can see wild boars and all kinds of jackals and all kinds of hawks, and it's just -- it's interesting, that way, 'cause I am -- anyway, I should not put it down. I had some good moments there, as well. And that's where they live. It's kind of a house rather than a flat. Before then, we were in flats, but this is a house.

CW:So, what were the -- what -- were you exposed to any languages other than 14:00Hebrew growing up?

AM:Well, as a baby, I lived -- I mean, that's not -- doesn't count, but I lived in London for a year, and then in the US, my third grade. So, I would say I was exposed to English. We -- other languages, I mean, there's a -- you talking about real fluent languages? You're not talking about expressions from other languages. Every day, I mean -- so, other languages, I would say -- I studied French in school for -- 'cause I went to Alliance in Haifa, and there's a -- French and not Arabic, as it should be, I think -- was the third language. And over the years, I need -- I can -- I need to refresh my (UNCLEAR) French, but there were years, I could hold up a conversation and do it -- anyway, at this time. So, those -- Hebrew, English, some French. And you hear Arabic, obviously. 15:00Haifa's a mixed -- make -- there's an Arabic population, Arab population in Haifa, so you hear it. It's also close to the Galil, which is majority Arab, and there's also the Druze villages, not too far from Haifa, so -- also Arabic-speaking. So, I heard Arabic, but I'm still -- have this desire to study it well.

CW:Yeah.

AM:So, yeah.

CW:Do you -- did you get any sense of attitudes towards Yiddish at any point and -- when you were growing up? Was it discussed?

AM:On occasion, yeah. My father would love that I'm saying -- telling this, but he -- because he grew up -- his -- my father's father, my paternal grandfather, he -- even though he was born in Palestine, as I said before, he actually, I 16:00think, knew Yiddish more than all the others. And he -- so, my father grew up with not being anti -- not a strict He-- he was Hebraist, but not -- he was able to throw in Yiddish expressions. However, my mother grew up in a house that there was -- father was an Arabic speaker and mother was a German speaker, but they made a point, as it was the zeitgeist -- to speak only -- ideology of the time was to speak only, strictly Hebrew with their kids. So, what was the question?

CW:If -- attitudes towards Yiddish.

AM:So, okay. So, if -- so, sometimes when my father throws a Yiddish expression, then my mother would get angry, because he can say -- he can find a parallel in 17:00Hebrew and he dared to say it in Yiddish. And attitude towards Yiddish -- well, when I -- it's funny, when I started learning the language, I definitely received some attitude in Israel. I -- when I -- even expressing the desire -- I mean, it's funny, because it's been so many years, and it's not all negative. But sometimes, older people -- told it was the lang-- of the street, it's a language of the goles [Diaspora], shprakh fun [language of] -- shefah shel hagalut [Hebrew: language of the Diaspora]. "How dare you study it?" I remember people in the street at Hebron University, even professors, educated, would sometimes say, "Yiddish, what do you want Yiddish for? There are other languages you can study." I heard that. I heard that. "Yiddish is a funny language." I heard that, that -- 'cause I -- studying also Hebrew, in the Hebrew literature department, Haifa. So, I had to be going ag-- in a minor way. I'm not giving 18:00myself any -- crowning myself a -- but in a minor way, I had to go somewhat against the grain. I mean, also in my class, in my Yiddish class, it was in Haifa where I started learning the language. First of all, it was -- studied purely as an academic language. There was no spoken Yiddish. There was just reading and translating, which I learned a lot from. My teacher, Arye Pilowsky, is great expert, but we did not -- and some of it was the Hebraism that didn't allow you, like in other languages, to study it spoken.

[BREAK IN RECORDING]

So, I guess let's just go right to when did -- first of all, you switched from engineering to humanities? Can you tell me about how that happened?

AM:It happened -- how that happened? I did not enjoy it so much. I was -- I 19:00began to study industrial engineering and management, and I didn't really enjoy the actual material that was studied. I'm good at math, so I -- but I had some desire -- I don't know, maybe after years in the Israeli army -- had maybe desire more for reading books, and that the -- that engineering seemed to be the colder -- I'm trying to put it in words. So, I -- so, engineering was -- I wasn't finding myself so much -- I wasn't feeling so comfortable there, and I decided to leave. And so, that's pretty much it. And I also had influences that 20:00I got from around -- like, romantic partners and my -- now my wife. But they were supportive. But, yeah, that's how --

CW:So, how did you -- what -- how did you -- what interested you about Yiddish at the beginning?

AM:Well, to tell you the truth, even in the technological school, the Technion, even though it's strictly engineering, math, physics, and so on, there is an elective -- you can elect a few courses in humanities -- there was generally -- and there is Yiddish there. At least there was when I -- so, I remember I even made it a point -- that even in engineering school, I'll take Yiddish at the end. What got me started in Haifa -- so, I got into the program that -- together with Hebrew literature, it's -- I did a program in the humanities that -- so, 21:00encourages you to take languages. And I was -- from before, I was planning on taking Yiddish. I had -- by then, I think I was already married or in a serious relationship. My wife, she's American-Israeli in Haifa, and I got all kinds of information in Yiddish and -- 'cause they're more directly related to the Yiddish culture, I guess, in the States, I was in -- beginning to understand. And there was a popular literature, a -- to be honest, my mother-in-law was a big supporter of the Yiddish Book Center from the beginning, and is -- she actually sent me, to Israel, Lansky's book. And I remember I read it, and I got hyped. So, by the time I got to Yiddish class, I was already ready to take it seriously. Oh, and I was -- that was my point before. So, even in my Yiddish 22:00class, university, was only academic Yiddish, there was me and three other older women, which -- all of them I love -- and there was a younger guy who started but left at some point. Oh, and me three or four older women. Those are the people who wanted to study Yiddish. So, as I said, against the grain, there was a bit of that. It wasn't hip, to -- also -- so, obviously, economically, you want to study languages that'll help you promote yourself, better your social, economic situation like English, Chinese. Not Yiddish. And so, I had that -- now, people ask me many times in the past, why -- what got me into Yiddish? That's what you're asking, yeah. I found out -- I had memories of being a kid, in Israel -- I was reading a lot from the library, the kids' library in the school. And I took a lot of books -- one of them was the Sholem Aleichem "Mayses 23:00far yidishe kinder [Stories for Jewish children]," in Hebrew, obviously. I had no idea about the Yiddish. So, I had a strong memory of reading that collection of stories, I guess in Berkovich's translations, that early Hebrew translation that I read. And I -- particularly, I remembered one story -- one of them who was the kid who discovers -- he made some mistake during Passover -- and he discovers a grain of -- a grain, basically, inside the chicken. And he made the mistake, that's how it got there, inside the chicken, it was something like that. I'm blurring a bit, even though I'm supposed to -- I read it afterwards, I think, in Yiddish take [actually] -- but I'm still forgetting that. And I think the description there of how the boy -- so, what he did in Sholem Aleichem's story, he took that grain without anybody seeing and swallowed it during the 24:00Passover seder. Now, of course, I experienced seders as a kid, so it was -- I was relating to that. So, it was about a Jewish -- but also -- I mean, we were never such -- so rigid, that -- the chometz is such an enemy. But -- not at all. But it also, obviously, universalizes the theme of doing something that's -- as a kid -- that you know you're not allowed to do, and that extreme feeling of shame and embarrassment. And you -- it's -- the way he described it made such an impression on me as a -- I was a -- yeah, in elementary school, I'm talking about. And so, it kind of stayed with me decades later. And so, people ask me why do I -- why did I study it? I say I wanted to read the literature, 'cause I discovered that it was translated, that -- from Yiddish. I had no idea when I 25:00was a kid, obviously. But I was -- and I discovered that it was written in Yiddish in the original, and I wanted to read the original. I wanted to read Sholem Aleichem in the original, I wanted to read I.B. Singer in the original. That basically was my mission at first.

CW:So, can you tell me about your first class, your first Yiddish class a little more?

AM:Oh, so, there was two years with Arye Pilowsky, who was -- who's a retired -- retired now, and he -- did a dissertation about Yiddish in pre-war -- pre-state Israel in the Palestine (UNCLEAR) and we -- he -- exceptionally good. His 26:00knowledge of Yiddish is enormous. It's also from the linguistic part, literary part -- but we didn't study spoken Yiddish. But it's -- to read texts, to this day, I owe him a lot of my abilities to go through a text and -- 'cause it was rigid reading every word and -- so, I owe him a lot. We studied with Weinreich the first year, the classic book. And then, the next year was these texts. So, we read the stories of Sholem Aleichem, all kinds of other texts. That was the two years of Haifa, and it was a -- although later, is in a couple of -- not at all -- in the middle. I remember one of them was actually my teacher, my Hebrew teacher in the school, in high school. That was funny, two of us together in main class, in Yiddish class, years later. And at some point -- so, that was two 27:00years. At the fourth semester, I also took -- I already knew that -- I already applied to Columbia University, during my third year. So, I knew I needed to strengthen my Yiddish even more. So, I went on the train once a week to a course in Tel Aviv, at Beth Shalom Aleichem with [Estelle Jansky?] -- is a fantastic teacher. And then we read texts and had discussions. And it's the first time I tried speaking the language, was there. And I also did the second Tel Aviv summer -- Yiddish summer program in that following summer. And, of course, everything was done in Yiddish. And I made an effort -- also, it helped that I wasn't exactly local, coming from Haifa, so I spoke Yiddish between the classes 28:00all the time, as much as I can, with -- and found native speakers and -- that came to the classes, and I made an effort to speak with them. And yeah, that was my early stages in Israel, in Yiddish.

CW:Yeah, I wanted to ask about native speakers. What native speakers did you connect with?

AM:Well, in the -- in Israel, there's - is -- because of the geography and stuff, in there, I was -- my first program, I was already pushed to the advanced class with Yitskhok Niborski -- was my teacher. And I didn't know much, but I was pushed there 'cause I needed a boost, and my teacher from Haifa -- and I didn't say that, my other advisor from Haifa was Rachel Rojanski, who's also now a professor at Brown. But she also got me hyped about the Yiddish culture, the 29:00Yiddish -- reading the history, Yiddishism. I didn't know anything about it just from Yiddish class. Not much. So, she also was a mentor early on. So, the -- so, in the advanced class, because of Israel's geography, you had people that -- well, an assortment. When I say native speakers, I also mean people who went to Yiddish schools in Argentina, for instance. Day schools. And they could talk Yiddish. But, to be honest, also in Haifa, I'm forgetting this, some relative of mine who I didn't mention before, 'cause he's kind of further away, from Galicia, if I'm not mistaken. And she -- Yiddish is her most favorite language. And she is krank [ill], not in the beste gezunt [best health], but I used to 30:00come with -- sorry, with the German teacher, was every -- my great aunt, 'cause those are two -- those at Haifa studied German -- basically, I didn't say that. I studied German and Yiddish at the same time. Started both languages at the same time, and both, studied for two years academically, so -- and German, I was really into studying German, there would be no mistake. I wasn't -- I was very bonded to that language, and I -- sometimes I feel bad that I'm -- if I'm neglecting it. I'm trying to read every text that I come by, not to forget. And I try to practice sometimes, but -- so, the German -- my great-aunt, the yeke, was every -- once a week, punkt [punctually], she barely missed a class. But the Yiddish teacher was always -- Berta, her name is Berta. The other one who's already dead, Tova, the great aunt. But the Yiddish teacher was always krekhtsn 31:00[groaning] and complaining, and this hurts, that hurts. And so, we didn't meet once a week. But she was a native Yiddish speaker that I actually met and tried to study with in Haifa. Almost forgot and I shouldn't. Berta. And in the Yiddish class in Tel Aviv -- so, I'm coming back to that -- there are people who heard a lot of -- at least heard a lot of native Yiddish being spoken. And I'm talking about secular people. And so, even the -- okay, they weren't exactly native speakers like the -- Berta, people like that, but they were -- they heard a lot of language, and I -- they were nice to try to communicate, because when you try to study a language, it's not really -- it's something to do with people and communicating with people if you're really interested in the language, rather than -- so, it's -- so, the same people, I mean, every day people, meaning not 32:00only academics. That's what I'm trying to say, 'cause I'm on academia, so long by now. So, it was good to mingle with Yiddish. And Tel Aviv's -- by the way, talking in the -- during that summer, talking on the bus, in Yiddish, in Tel Aviv, you raise -- a lot of people turn their heads. And so -- like it sounds familiar. They look at you, and really, I made a point of -- we spoke Yiddish in the buses and the street. Everywhere, we spoke Yiddish. I remember that, so that's interesting.

CW:So, how did the Yiddish scene, attitudes towards Yiddish -- what did you notice that was different in New York versus what you had been exposed to previously?

AM:It's a good question. It's a great question. Well, suddenly, the focus 33:00shifted of what you're interested in. Suddenly, from -- slightly from focusing on comparing it with Hebrew literature -- which it was, it's --

[BREAK IN RECORDING]

AM:And it's what I do with my work. I'm a scholar of both Hebrew literature and Yiddish literature. And so you always had to -- both -- think about both. And now, I know the founder of both modern literatures, was -- who is why -- I mean, Mendele was -- Abramovitsh was the founder of both literatures. So, there's -- and my -- many of those writers were bilingual. So, it's an important thing to look at. And in Israel, I guess it's pretty -- obviously, for me, natural because I come from Hebrew literature. And in New York, suddenly there could be 34:00Yiddish and -- but no -- maybe Yiddish and English more than Yiddish and Hebrew, which sees like the twins in some -- various ways. And I don't know, suddenly it's Yiddish New York. I didn't know much about it. I don't think I knew tons about it before, Yiddish New York. Now it's a big theme in my work, in my -- when I studied, they -- so, Yiddish versus influence in English and those writers, and how big was the Yiddish culture in America? I'm not sure I realized -- I mean, I knew a bit. But no, in other words, how big it actually was. So, yeah. I mean, in Israel, you have -- whether it's true or false, I'm not getting 35:00into now. But I grew up, at least, with a notion that what we do -- in Israel, the Hebrew in Israel, we -- speaking in our culture is continuing the modern Hebrew culture from Europe, from the Jewish enlightenment Haskalah came up here to today. And we are continuing that, continuous line. And Yiddish, whether it's true or not, that's a different question. But that's how you -- and Yiddish, in America, it's definitely not the case. I mean, I -- you -- I mean, okay, several American Jewish thinkers -- try to call -- there are many others. I mean, couple try to call English the new Yiddish. You can call it, fine, but it's -- you can 36:00make that case. Can make that case. But it's slightly harder than the one with Israeli Hebrew and modern European Hebrew. So, I -- of course, the script and all that. I mean, it's slightly harder. I mean, you can talk about the symbolic level, it's fine. But, you see, people didn't grow up, it -- and it's a dead speaking -- even though some Jewish American thinkers came up with the idea that they -- the people didn't -- they grew up with speaking English. And, so, there was some -- I understood it, also from reading Lansky's book, that there was a more -- I mean, it's true, is -- Yiddish was not treated so nicely in -- obviously, I'm putting it mildly, in Palest-- in pre-state and State of Israel. But in Lansky's book, you read how basically their books found themselves in the garbage cans in the US. So, yeah, I was -- I'm -- I'll -- want me to say all 37:00kinds of discussions with American Jews. So, yes, there is a feeling of some loss, great loss, which, in Israel, true or false, you don't have.

CW:And so, how -- what was sort of the scene of Yiddish academically in New York when you arrived? At Columbia, who did you study with, who were your inspirations?

AM:Well, first person who accepted me into the program of Yiddish studies at Columbia University was -- as part of the Germanic department there, is the head of the program, Jeremy Dauber. And he still is a young -- I mean, is -- time passes, but I -- when I -- definitely when I came, I was young, still, I'm not 38:00tenured. And the program was growing. Like, I was -- the program was renewing itself. And I took courses with him. Our first semester was Introduction to Yiddish Drama. Seminars. Every week, we read a Yiddish play, in -- of course, obviously in Yiddish. A Yiddish play. That improved my Yiddish a lot, and I enjoyed it very much. It was small seminar, like four, five people. And I took one course of advanced Yiddish with the teacher, who's by now retired. Excuse me. Miriam Hoffman. So, we read Chaim Grade, his novel. I think she teaches it -- she taught it for quite a while, that same story that -- "Mayn krig mit hersh 39:00reseyner [My quarrel with Hersh Rasseyner]," something like that. And I took a lot of courses with David Roskies. Big mentor, and -- at JTS. Took about Sholem Aleichem, about Haskalah literature, about Jewish American literature, Yiddish American literature. And I think there's even one more. Poetry -- Yiddish poetry seminar. So, I took a lot of Dave Roskies, took a lot with Dauber. I think my second year, Dan Miron came back from a sabbatical and I took a year's seminar with him. It was a tremendous experience. Then, that seminar was the -- I mean, not the basis, but it was based on this book that came out in '09, "From Continuity to Contiguity" -- forgive me that I'm missing the title, but there's 40:00-- very important book. It was fantastic. We read Yiddish stuff, Hebrew stuff, German, and English. So, that was really perfect for me, because we were reading also Heine. I didn't mention Heine before, but I was -- was my favorite poet when I studied German. And then, after my grandmother died, and discovered that she knew his poems by heart. I didn't know that. I'm saying Heine, because he influenced all of the modern Hebrew and Yiddish writers. So, the -- and Niborski was in the Yiddish seminars that took us -- in the Yiddish seminars. Nieborski was very influential in the passion for Yiddish. That I took in the summers. And so, with Miron -- so, I ended up working my dissertation with both Dauber, 41:00Jeremy Dauber and Dan Miron. So, it's a privilege to -- working with both, obviously.

CW:So, you started by saying that some things that led you toward Yiddish were sort of rebellious, (laughs) right? Can you say more about that? Yeah.

AM:Yes, going -- choosing it is choosing a bit against the grain, whether it's Israel, for the reasons -- for various reasons, and also here, obviously, because if you want to do well, you go to high tech or you go to -- you do business degree. And basically, also, my engineering management was that direction. And choosing the humanities, which was also dwindling down in our time -- and in it, choose Yiddish, dafke [specifically] Yiddish -- yes, you go 42:00against the grain. You go against the grain of -- and it's funny, I don't think I even knew that -- how much Yiddish was associated with leftist groups. I don't think I knew that. I had an urge to go to the dafke [the contrary point] in a bit when I did Yiddish and Hebrew, and I had -- took the Yiddish, and I accused the Hebrew writers of not being nice to Yiddish, so -- (laughter) but I -- so, later on, when I discovered also -- such a bond between the Yiddish and leftist movement, obviously, I became more and more intrigued, and I was involved a bit in this -- those activities in New York, like seders I went to then, the communist seder, the communist Jews, the -- like, the Kinder Ring was more 43:00moderate left. And so, I was intrigued. So, definitely, that goes against the grain of what -- and I also intrigued how much it was relevant to my -- I think today, those bonding between those leftist movements and the culture. I felt that -- I very -- felt very connected to it. And that was another reason to go deeper into Yiddish, I guess, yeah.

CW:So, what was the Yiddish scene sort of out of the classroom? You -- the -- in New York, there are various Yiddish, non-academic institutions: Yugntruf, "Forverts." What was your involvement in -- outside of classroom?

AM:Well, I went to Yidish-Vokh two and a half times. I was intrigued. I think I read Shandler book already in Is-- Jeffrey Shandler's book, "Adventures in Yiddish"-- I already -- "in Yiddishland" already in Israel. So, he mentioned the Yidish-Vokh. So, I was intrigued by it in the first place, already then. But also, later, in Columbia, part of the program, you teach Yiddish for two or three years. And actual-- teach another TA. So, I wanted to prepare myself for teaching Yiddish, obviously, so I wanted to go there -- again, to Yidish-Vokh. And the Yugntruf, I went here and there in New York to that -- very rarely, to be honest, to the activities. I do go -- yeah, and so pretty rarely to that. I barely remember it. But I did try, as much as I can, go to leyenkrayz [reading 45:00circle] at -- another teacher of mine was Dovid Fishman. Yeah, Dovid Fishman. So, he hosts a leyenkrayz every other -- every Sunday? Every other Sunday? So, I try to go. I mean, not always I can. I'm pretty tired, usually. So (UNCLEAR) but I try to go, and that's another -- New York Yiddish thing that I do. I go to Yiddish theaters at some point. Some point after -- you mentioned the "Forverts." After I defended my -- not my dissertation. That didn't happen yet. But after I defended my abstract, my proposal, I felt so liberated. Of course, it's illusion. But I felt -- so, I applied -- there was a -- they wanted an assistant at the "Forward," so I applied, and it was two days a week, and I was there for a couple months. It was lots of fun. I think I did that with many 46:00other things at the same time. So, at some point, had to dwindle down my -- 'cause I was researching for papers, academically. I was working the "Forverts" redaktsye [editorial staff]. I was teaching at YIVO at some point, and I was active politically. So, it was altogether -- what was left of it (laughter) was that I still became -- I'm still a writer for the "Forverts" for the past couple years since I started working there, I'm a columnist every -- bi-monthly contributions. And that was 'cause I read the "Forverts." Even in Israel, I was subscribing -- there was a Yiddish Israeli edition, which graphically looks different than the one -- the other -- the rest of the world sees. And now it's sometimes -- now, I think it even looks nicer in Israel, it -- just the cover 47:00page or some of the pages. But back then, it looked horrible. It was like Xerox papers. Still, I got it in Haifa, and I was trying to learn that -- it's -- I read the "Vayter." Back then, it was barely online, or I wasn't aware of it, anyway, and was just the paper. So, I read the "Forverts" since my -- maybe since the first year I studied it, I read the "Vayter," pretty sure, and started reading "Forverts" articles, then, my first year of Yiddish. So, then -- and so, obviously, I was kind of excited to work there. And then, obviously -- also knowing that the writers, like it's Itskhok Bashevis Zinger worked -- published there and stuff. So, you're part of a big tradition, so -- and I think that was the first time I was introduced to some -- a regular -- who -- well, what other 48:00papers have regular Bundist columnists? So, Luden, Itzhak Luden was writing from Israel, and there is -- H.A. Barat, as well. So, yeah, I -- and since I'm writing in Yiddish, I think, for two-and-a-half years by now, a regular -- and have all kinds of stories around that, obviously. And since then, I also wrote for the -- I think the last Bundist journal in the world, in Yiddish, "[Der hasidisher bundist?]" which comes out in Israel, and in "Lebns-fragn," and I just got an email from the editor, Luden, editor -- he wants another one. That -- I'll barely -- that -- but I -- since I love him so much, I can't -- it's hard for me to say no. I might have to do -- don't tell him, even though it's really -- and, yeah, he's over ninety years old, and he's feisty and a Bundist.

CW:Can you describe him some more?

AM:Yes, he's -- he was originally from Warsaw, grew up in the Bundist circles, studied in the Bundist school. And then the war, of course, and he found himself in Israel, and he -- and all of his life, he became a Yiddish journalist in Israel. Not alwa-- he was always a Bundist by his convictions, but not always -- it was Bundist papers. "Letste Nayes" was just the Yiddish paper in Israel, was non-Bundist. But -- so, he wrote for all kinds of Yiddish publications, and so there's -- "Letste Nayes," "Tsukunft," there's -- and the "Forverts," and so I -- and the "Forverts," and I started to read him and his books. I found out that my father bought a birthday present, couple days ago, and it was his two-volume 50:00collection of his articles. And I found out that my father was the first one who bought it. He -- of course, when you buy it, you have to call him and ask for it to be shipped. So he was the first. And I think a year ago, was it, I was with my -- I was visiting Israel, and I went with my father to this theater, and Luden was there with his wife, and he started -- we spoke in Yiddish and my father was next to him, and Luden addressed him in Yiddish, as well. But he found out very soon that my father actually doesn't understand the language. (laughter) And so, it was funny, that switch. Generational switch. And so -- and yeah, so he's an ac-- he's over ninety years old now. Feisty. Unfortunately, many of his comrades are not longer with us. I mean, the Israeli Bundists -- the 51:00people are very occupied with the history of the Israeli Bund, specifically. So, many of them already have passed away, unfortunately. But he's still going, and he has the longest Yiddish Bundist journal ever, in the world, now. Maybe the only one, I think, yeah.

CW:So, what connection, if any, is there between Yiddish and your political affiliation or political work?

AM:I think it has a lot to do with it. I mean, I'm -- I can easily buy into -- I mean, critically, I can always look at it from a distance, but I can easily still buy into the fact -- the image of Yiddish as the language of the oppressed, the language of people who went -- driven away from places, were suffering, were not -- didn't have a force in Yiddish, and didn't -- and helped 52:00me understand that -- in Yiddish, that -- how fragile -- I remember in Haifa, we also studied the text by [Lurye?], which he was writing from the ghetto, in Yiddish. And [Lurye]? Or that's his son, [Lurye]? One of the YIVO -- was various famous, and it was very touching, and it was -- as the forces were coming into Lithuania -- what's the capital? Vilnius -- in Vilna -- he was writing this Yiddish text about -- thinking about the Yiddish culture, Jewish culture. And we also read that year, the -- Heschel, Avrom Yoshua Heschel, in Yiddish, not many people know that he wrote in Yiddish. I mean, there are quite a few, but (UNCLEAR). And so, yes, so my -- it influenced me, learning Yiddish. It 53:00influenced me a lot. I mean, I thought I was progressive growing up in Israel. I thought so. I -- my family worked for the left, and grandparents, they all voted -- everybody votes for the left. And I think Yiddish helped me formulate -- but you can argue whether it's -- how left was it -- you vote for leftist party, doesn't mean -- parties, doesn't mean that -- it's all context, you need to contextualize everything. But I think it helped me formulate my convictions, that the world that we live in is -- needs to change, and probably radically. And Yiddish helps you. I just taught a course in -- University of Maryland, at 54:00-- Radical Jewish Literature. And we studied this -- anarchist Yiddish poetry, and studied communist writers, socialist. But even the discussion about how to create a better world was, I guess -- I say this, I give you now a contemporary example. I found, by chance, one of my articles in the "Forverts" was discussed in "The Atlantic," just last week. I didn't know. I don't read "The Atlantic," but my -- head of my department, "Adi, you're famous!" I say, "Why, why?" Said they were discussing -- "The Atlantic," and they really wanted to know what's 55:00written there, 'cause it was mentioned in a panel, in an English panel somewhere, that the Yiddish -- this book that was critical of Israeli policies -- the English "Forward" gave it a very nasty review. Barely were they reading it. I read the English review, the -- it seemed like they barely read it, and they only quoted the chapter titles -- but I spoke with the guy, I interviewed him, talk about interviews, and he -- and I know we have mutual people -- anyway, I -- he was reporting -- he was a journalist. He was reporting what he's seeing, and it wasn't pretty. So, I was -- my tone towards it was not -- wasn't all negative, 'cause why is it bad to raise criticism? It doesn't mean you have to agree with every -- of his -- every one of his conclusions, which he says clearly in the introduction to his book. But he has -- and it's -- actually, 56:00it's a good thing to raise criticism, and that's -- firmly believe that, and I -- because I'm intimate with the subject, I kind of knew -- and it was not then -- so, I -- so, my article was discussed in those panels, and then this "Atlantic" reporter really wanted to know the Yiddish, and he got some retired linguistic professors to help him translate parts, and it's quoted there. And he wanted to know -- and at the end, he says, "You know what? Maybe" -- he was comparing the Yiddish and English, he said, "Maybe it's easier to raise -- to be -- criticism, be more -- freely with how you express yourself -- of others -- considered radical, and it -- in a group language, like a small group, like a mishpokhe [family] language," or something like that. So -- and not that I'm for 57:00-- by the way, I'm not -- I don't know if I'm a Yiddishist or not. I don't think that all -- forgive me, but I don't think that all Jews need to know Yiddish, or that it'll necessarily make their life better, or that it's a Jewish -- particularly Jewish -- I'm not in that place. I'm -- but I do think that if you study Yiddish, my experience, my personal experience, is that you do get exposed to these -- this material that -- it seems like maybe people were more -- feeling freer to express themselves, because they knew it was in Yiddish, so that -- the Yiddish anarchists, when they had this paper, the "Arbeter shtime" that was around for decades and decades, longer than any anarchist paper in the world, maybe that -- and the -- also the communist and socialists -- it was maybe easier because it was in Yiddish, and it -- they knew who they were writing for. So, their discourse could be more of -- freer, less constraints. 58:00Maybe mainly in America. Obviously, there was problems in many decades to publish in Yiddish in Eastern Europe, but -- in Russia -- and under the czar, but -- and the Bund had, obviously, underground libraries and all that. But I don't know. I think, from my experience, it seems like -- because it's not connected to any establishment, any state -- this is not only the anarchist, but also the socialist -- maybe. Maybe because of that, it's a very fulfilling experience that we exposed to that material, so -- my own personal experience.

CW:Yeah. Here, you can have this. I didn't have any. (laughs)

AM:Ah, thank you, thank you.

CW:Sure.

AM:I'm dried up.

CW:(laughs) How often do you use Yiddish in your daily life?

AM:Spoken or --

CW:Yeah.

AM:(laughs) Well -- or just written?

CW:I guess I -- both.

AM:Well, written, quite often, because I do write every -- at least every other week, if not more. And also, between the Yiddish people, you email in Yiddish, and you read some stuff in Yiddish. So, they -- the writing -- so, it's kind of a -- almost a daily thing. Almost, I can say. Speaking it is a different matter. I don't speak much Yiddish -- as much as I -- I mean, I don't have family and stuff that's Yiddish speakers. I try to speak Yiddish with people who know Yiddish, and I -- and mostly I taught Yiddish, and I'm going to teach Yiddish next semester. So, I do speak Yiddish, but I don't -- my daily life, I -- mostly 60:00English or Hebrew, to be honest, and less spoken Yiddish. I speak -- on social events, like alcohol -- even though I don't drink. But this is hilarious, because my last article in the "Forverts," some khosid [follower of Hasidism] guy left a comment briefly after it was published saying, "Adi!" It was praising me. "Your Yiddish, we talk" -- he was from Kiryas Joel, a khosid from Kiryas Joel, telling me, "Ah, you're Yiddish is so rich and your loshn-koydesh [Yiddish words with Hebrew or Aramaic roots]." Because -- I guess I know Hebrew quite good, and, "Your loshn-koydesh, and then you see how much your Yiddish is so much better than all the Yiddish professors from YIVO who don't speak Yiddish in their daily lives." And I was -- of course, it's hilarious, because I -- it's the comment there, you can read it, it's in Yiddish. It's hilarious, because I studied from the Yiddish professors from YIVO, my Yiddish, and because I don't 61:00speak Yiddish in my daily life. But it's -- that's hilarious. So, that's an anecdote. (laughs)

CW:You mentioned that you have had some contact, like working on a film in Monsey. What -- can you tell me about the contact you've had with the Hasidic community in New York?

AM:Yeah, so far, I've worked on two Yiddish-speaking films -- yeah, that film, that was a documentary, about the anti-Zionist ultra-Orthodox group in Neturei Karta, which has some families -- it's a very small group. Some families live in Monsey, New York. It's a -- it's like a -- kind of a shtetl in New York State. And we went -- so, I was -- I volunteered to be -- the director wanted to do interviews in Yiddish, specifically, for the movie, even though she doesn't know 62:00Yiddish. But she wanted to show them in the most authentic or the most -- as they are, 'cause they are Yiddish speakers. They know English, but they are a Yiddish-speaking community. So, they were -- she wanted to show the most religious -- so, she was interested in the anti-Zionism, mostly. She herself is anti-Zionist, and she -- I volunteered to be an interpret-- so, what did she want? She wanted to ask in English, but he answered -- he -- the guy answers in Yiddish. But she doesn't understand what he answers, and he -- so, I was interpreting that. So, she wanted to do a follow-up in English. She followed up. So, I was translating his Yiddish, which, of course, was a challenge. I had to be -- but it went well, actually, they spoke Yiddish -- clearly, to my ears. And 63:00it was a good experience. I -- it was extremely interesting to visit that family. It was during a preparation for Passover. And there -- had a real, old-school oven, brick over, and the whole family, three -- at least three generations were working on making those shmurah [kosher for Passover] matzos. There was a sight, I'm telling you. That was a sight to see. And that's -- that happens in Monsey, and that was fascinating. And yeah, it was -- I think I've -- maybe I've seen again one of them. And also, helped her with videos and helped translate. That was -- but that trip to Monsey was -- and that conversation -- were -- I don't -- was -- strong experiences, I'd say that. Let's say that. 64:00Yeah, so that was that trip.

CW:So, I'm wondering what it's like to teach Yiddish. What is your experience with your students? What are the challenges and good things about teaching Yiddish content?

AM:Yiddish content or Yiddish language?

CW:Both.

AM:Okay, Yiddish language, I've been teaching for more years now, and American students, all of them. So, many of the -- it's a good question. What kind of students' challenges --

CW:For you, what are the --

AM:Yeah.

CW:-- delights and the challenges of teaching?

AM:I found myself, for instance, for years, more or less -- I'm exaggerating, 65:00but more or less, the only times I spoke was in the live Yiddish class was in the Yiddish class. So, listening to myself. (laughs) That's when I have -- the spoken Yiddish, I was -- and most of the spoken Yiddish I was exposed to was that. And then, my idea, bec-- the way we do it in Columbia -- first, that's where I first taught -- as to do the communicative approach. So, we just -- just spoken. So, you got to get them going. So, we always did -- I wanted to be able to stimulate them, so we did a lot of -- there was always a discussion theme at the beginning of the class. So, I did a lot of political themes, and it really gets people going. And they're really frustrated if they can't express themselves the way -- but I -- of course, I don't let them speak in English. So, it's the -- for the -- it pushes them, for those three weeks -- three -- sorry, 66:00three days a week, that hour -- if they want to express themselves, they have to get the Yiddish, so -- and when it's -- if they want to participate in the discussion, and share with us their khokhmes [wisdom] and -- so, I always did that. It was more just trying to do it vibrant, let's try to do it dynamic, interesting, relevant rather than older models of what the Yiddish culture is, stuff like that.

CW:So, who are your students?

AM:Along the years, I had many -- so, that's the Yiddish language course around -- at Columbia, mostly, what I spoke about now. I think in Columbia, they're all Americ--variations of American Jews, yeah, pretty much. I had one Israeli -- two Israelis in my Yiddish class in Columbia 'cause many Israelis -- in Columbia. 67:00And that was interesting, 'cause I -- and every time I have a Hebrew speaker in my Yiddish class, it's easy when I -- 'cause I do Yiddish in Yiddish, so I try to mix -- so, sometimes I have a Russian speaker, a German speaker -- so, I try to mix and get what everybody knows and, of course, relate to the English knowledge, how Yiddish is close to English -- so, I try to get everybody involved and get them to get it. (laughter) And now, I also teach content courses. I taught now Introduction to Yiddish Culture, that Radical Jewish Literature -- and had one non-Jewish student in my Introduction to Yiddish Culture class. But he's a major in Germanics, so he knows German, so I'm trying 68:00to -- but, yes, my goal would have been to be as inclusive as possible, 'cause that non-Jewish student, he had some fear temporar-- that he doesn't know the Hebrew alphab-- even though it's just a culture class, not even a -- but he doesn't know the Hebrew alphabet and he can't really -- and he doesn't get many of the Jewish concepts, like some people know it so well, those who know Hebrew, those who -- more traditional. And so -- but I really tried to persuade him, yeah, to stay in the course. This is not a Jewish summer camp. This is an academic course. You have no requirement for that -- this is not -- we're not here construct-- this is Jewish study. This is academia. This is not construction of a -- manufacturing of an identity that some Jewish institutions 69:00-- forgive me if that's -- I'm not saying that's you, but I'm just saying that they're occupied with perpetuating the specific Jewish identity and they -- in academia, and it's not that. It's not that experience. We don't have that goal. We're not supposed to have it, that goal. We just -- and -- but obviously, we're saying that. That was Yiddish class. Was many -- most of the people are Jews, and Yiddish culture -- and that's, we -- saying this could be -- obviously, this happens in many other groups, but now we focus on Jews and Jewish concepts. That's how we solve it. (laughs)

CW:So, I just have a few more questions.

AM:Sure.

CW:What is -- from your perspective, what is the place of Yiddish within, first, 70:00the Israeli academy and then I'll ask about the US academy. But where -- what's the place of Yiddish in the Israeli academy?

AM:Well, unfortunately, Yiddish is not defined in the whole status of the humanities, which is not in the best gezunt. It's -- and by this -- lower and less tenured positions. And so, the whole humanities is, sadly, diminishing in general. So, Yiddish, not -- is not -- does not live apart from that. So, it's -- so there -- the facts are very clear. There used to be a Yiddish, I don't know, department or chair in the Hebrew University of Jerusalem -- I don't know if it was department or a smaller scale than department. I'm trying to -- I'm 71:00blanking now. But anyway, there was a real -- somewhat of a real pull, and now, not so much. It's sort of -- it's merged with -- that attempt to do -- I mean, I'm not there now, so -- but I just -- I know that there are attempts to do programs with -- joint programs with different universities and the -- teach Yiddish and -- what they do in Tel Aviv was great, the Tel Aviv summer programs are very successful. I know they do a great job and so, that's what I -- Tel Aviv is a great city, so I had a great time doing those Yiddish programs. I did one summer program and one seminar for graduate students the next -- the following year, so -- and so, that's -- there's a -- there's some interest, but humanities in general needs to get out of its crisis forever. (UNCLEAR) -- but 72:00yeah, so Yiddish is dependent on the -- how humanities in general is valued in the society, yeah. I guess that's the same for America. That was your next question, right? So, in -- America's slightly -- I mean, also, humanities here not -- also not the best status, working at jobs and at -- so much now, but it's still slightly better than Israel now. So, I mean, I'm working, so that's somewhat of a miracle. And -- (laughs) so, I -- listen, there's a lot of potential in both America and Israel. It just -- and some examples in Israel 73:00show to that, like the summer program and stuff, and here in America, obviously there's an interest. People apply to study Yiddish at Columbia and NYU, and there's conferences, there's books coming out. People are interested. There's you.

CW:(laughs) People talk about a Yiddish revival.

AM:Right.

CW:Do you -- what's your take on that? Do you -- yeah.

AM:I don't know what the revival means, exactly. It's -- I know Shandler can write about Jewish sensitivity. There's -- basically, if you quote (UNCLEAR) Dovid Katz, you don't need a revival, because it's living, but not that in -- 74:00secular communities. And so, theoretically, you don't need a revival for something that's living, correct me if I'm wrong, right? So, there's some problem with the way you frame that question. And amongst the sec-- more secular Yiddish revival -- there's interest in Yiddish. Listen, when my -- or my students in Maryland -- is exposed -- some of them come from Jewish day schools, who think they know everything about Jewish -- the important things, and suddenly, they come into Yiddish class and they -- this -- and they know that they learn nothing about this topic, and this Jewish education, which was pretty extensive. They're -- I mean, it's -- a whole new world opens to them, and they are very interested in their Jewishness, I mean, so it's -- so, revival, it's -- 75:00there's interest. There is interest. I mean, my courses for next semester, already -- one of them is already full and with a waiting list. And I'm starting -- yeah, have enough students for my Introduction to Yiddish Literature next semester, and I have enough students for my face-to-face Beginners Yiddish class. My course, Online Yiddish, is a pilot that I'm starting next semester -- is already full, with a waiting list. So, there -- interest, there is interest. People want to know. So, I wouldn't call it a revival, but there's interest. (laughs) Yeah.

CW:Great. Well, I have two more questions, but is there anything that you -- 76:00specific areas related to these topics we've been talking about that I haven't asked you about? I mean, yeah, that you wanted to talk about?

AM:I'm --

CW:No, okay.

AM:Yeah.

CW:Well, I wanted to ask you, actually, about the --

AM:Oh, yeah, I can say that my first -- by the way, I have that German Jewish background. My first -- my experience with Yiddish became -- interesting, my first academic -- ever academic conference was -- I did a lecture in Yiddish. It was in Germany. So, it was -- I have quite a few first things that -- actually 77:00did in Yiddish. The first time -- I think the first time I read Marx was in Yiddish. And the first academic conference, the first teaching was Yiddish, more or less, yeah. I had a -- have quite a few -- ah, oh, and that's the non-academic thing. I did research, and I asked a few people, including Luden -- and I know that I'm the first sabra, Israeli-born, ever to become a Yiddish journalist. (laughs) So, I know that for a fact. There's no other -- I'm the fir-- there might to be other later -- even though I started not too long ago -- maybe after me, but I'm the first sabra to ever become a Yiddish journalist. (laughs) So, I got that for you.

CW:Sh'koyekh [Bravo]. I wanted to ask you about -- I think you have a story about the -- Hurricane Sandy, and a Yiddish announcement?

AM:Hurricane Sandy. I don't think I discussed the Yiddish announcement. There 78:00was a Yiddish announcement, but I didn't discuss the Yiddish announcement.

CW:You weren't involved in it?

AM:No, I tell you what I did. No, there is a story around that. I -- somebody forward me that they -- they were doing rescue in -- rescue missions in Brighton Beach, in Brooklyn. And they said they need Russian and Yiddish interpreters. So, they've -- this guy who knew I know Yiddish forwarded it to me, and I went -- of course, I was the only Yiddish guy, there's -- later on, afterwards, I saw another guy who spoke Yiddish, but he wasn't from the interpreters. So, with interpreters, there was all Russians, and I was the Yiddish guy. And were supposed to wait -- the phone calls for people who were stuck. People were stuck there for weeks without electricity, without heating -- obviously without heating, without running water, sometime -- running water, maybe I'm exaggerating. But yeah, there was also that. And maybe they -- also, something 79:00happened to their -- other -- happened to their houses and they need help. So, we were supposed to wait for the cell phones. I didn't get any call. The Russians did, because the assumption was, actually, that many of those Russians who also know -- they -- many of the Yiddish speakers also know Russian, so I -- at some point, I just went with one of the groups, one of the missions, to -- let's go door-to-door in Brighton Beach and try to see -- help people and try to basically write their complaints or write their problems. And I went door-to-door, and one of the doors was a woman -- older woman from Bessarabia who was thrilled to talk Yiddish with me, and her son was sick, really poor, very poor, and her son was sick, he couldn't take care of himself, and they were 80:00without electricity. They couldn't move anywhere, and they're like that for weeks. No heating, is pretty bad. And she was thrilled to talk Yiddish with me and to tell me her problems in Yiddish. And I filled out the form of -- with her problems. She told me in Yiddish and I wrote it in English. And I felt that I -- it was a really humanist test that this other person found another language that is most comfortable. She knew Russian, I think, or Romanian, Russian. But her Yiddish was thrilling for her to -- this -- in her very bad state that she was -- and I was personally thrilled to be able to offer some very specific help 81:00with that Yiddish. So, I did that. And I mention-- and I did write an article in the "Forverts" about the -- about Sandy, but -- and I mentioned in a line maybe that, but I -- now I'm expanding what I'm telling you, so, yeah, that was a --

CW:Yes. Oh, well, I wanted to ask if you've been -- I know you did the -- maybe the summer -- the Yiddish program in Warsaw?

AM:That's right, yes.

CW:So, can you tell me just what it was like for you to be in Eastern Europe?

AM:Right, I -- at that point, I was already -- knew that I'm going to focus my dissertation on I.L. Peretz, and so I thought it would be cool to spend time in Warsaw. My Yiddish was pretty good at that time. It was not -- but it was -- still, it was fun to do, and I met some people that I didn't know before, like one of my teachers was [Ajile?] from Medem Center in Paris, and some friends -- Lichtenboym from Argentina. And so, it was just a fun experience. To be there, I 82:00was -- it was my second visit to Eastern Europe. My first was a couple years before my father -- who -- we spent time in Warsaw and Krakow, and he -- for my father, it was extremely interesting, 'cause his mother spoke Polish. Not to him, but he heard Polish. And he felt like he was -- he felt -- and I'm not exaggerating. He said, "I feel at home a bit," 'cause the foods, some of the dress, some of the -- and some of the languages, it was all familiar, somewhat, somewhat, to him. 'Cause at first, he's -- told me my -- his mother -- the only things she used to cook was more Eastern European stuff, and then later, she moved more and more to the local ingredients, Boston dishes. So, she -- and, 83:00yeah, so it wasn't really like going to the camps. Both my visits in Eastern Europe is -- well, I'm saying it because many Israelis, that's what they know from being in Poland, is going -- doing a camp tour -- concentration camps, obviously, I'm talking about, but -- and we went to Auschwitz, but actually it was not such a good experience for different reasons which I won't get into. And so, it was -- yeah, it was just -- I mean, Warsaw is -- I mean, it's not the same Warsaw. But still, I enjoyed the people, the food, the -- yeah, it was fun to be where Yiddish -- that Yiddish that I'm reading so much and I'm writing about -- where it was produced, the actual local -- and so --

CW:Yeah. Well, I'd like to end by asking if you have an eytse, if you have a 84:00piece of advice for future -- maybe Yiddish students.

AM:Yiddish students. I would -- my advice would be even if this is not your central focus in your life, you're not -- obviously, very few people can make money -- a living at it, but -- of Yiddish. But even if you take it -- and I know -- I guess that applies to more things, but specifically in Yiddish, you take a Yiddish class -- first of all, take a Yiddish class. But second, if you take a Yiddish class, take it seriously, too. I mean, because it will be rewarding in ways that -- not necessarily you can anticipate before you came into that class. And it will be kind of -- you'll learn a lot of life lessons about a human experience and richness of culture that you're not necessarily 85:00expecting, and you'll gain a lot out of it, I feel. So, just come -- yeah, come -- Yiddish classes with -- seriously, and don't ever settle -- try not to settle for the translation, but work vigorously with the originals. I mean, I'm a literature person, so that's what I'm focusing now on. And, yeah, just take it seriously, and that's the basis, also, to enjoy it. So, it's a -- so, it's not -- and not -- take it serious, but enjoy it. But if you take it seriously, you'll be able to get more out of it and enjoy it. And I think it's -- you'll find it worth your while. So, my advice, zay ernst [take it seriously]. (laughter)

CW:Great. Nu, a hartsikn dank --

AM:Oh --

CW: -- thank you very much for --

AM:-- nishto far vos [you're welcome], yeah.

CW:-- taking the time to speak with me and with the Yiddish Book Center.

AM:Zikher, a fargenign [Sure thing, it was a pleasure].

CW:A dank.

[END OF INTERVIEW]